※ 本文為 kulinomi 轉寄自 ptt.cc 更新時間: 2012-08-01 21:52:15
看板 Jeremy_Lin
作者 標題 [外絮] NBA版《權力遊戲》PART 1(節錄)
時間 Wed Aug 1 00:00:06 2012
譯者:chaunceylee13
已徵得譯者同意轉載並修改部分不同慣用語,僅節錄與Lin相關部分。
原文:http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8182261/game-nba-thrones-part-i
Breaking down the winners and losers in the NBA kingdom - Grantland
With news coming from every corner of the basketball kingdom, it's time to hand out some awards. ...
With news coming from every corner of the basketball kingdom, it's time to hand out some awards. ...
http://0rz.tw/8QYsz
Breaking down the winners and losers in the NBA kingdom - Grantland
With news coming from every corner of the basketball kingdom, it's time to hand out some awards. ...
With news coming from every corner of the basketball kingdom, it's time to hand out some awards. ...
Game of NBA Thrones, Part 1
With news coming from every corner of the basketball kingdom, it's time to
hand out some awards
By Bill Simmons on July 20, 2012
Bill Simmons:NBA版《權力遊戲》PART 1
"I'm looking at spending the rest of my life being treated like a
fool and a eunuch by my own people. Ask yourself: Is there anything Iwouldn't do to stop that from happening?"
「我正眼睜睜地看著自己在餘生中被自己的子民當成白痴和閹人。捫心自問:為了
阻止這件事的發生,我還有什麼不能做的麼?」
For Rockets GM Daryl Morey, who took the phrase "all in" to new levels with
his dogged pursuit of Dwight Howard. At this point, Dork Elvis has done
everything short of holding a boom box in the pouring rain outside of
Dwight's Los Angeles hotel … and that's probably happening tomorrow night.
His strategy makes sense: You can't win the title without a top-10 player.
Unfortunately for the Rockets, they've been trapped in NBA no-man's-land ever
since T-Mac and Yao broke down. Last year, they barely missed the playoffs
AND paid the luxury tax, which simply can't happen — in a 30-team league,
you either want to bottom out or contend, but you can't be in the middle. The
Rockets spent the last three years stockpiling assets and cap space for this
exact moment. It's Howard, Bynum or Bust.1
火箭的總經理Daryl Morey,在他對於Dwight Howard頑固的追逐中把「孤注一擲」
這個詞演繹到了全新的層次。現在,Dork Elvis做了一切,就差在Howard下榻的
洛杉磯酒店外頂著傾盆大雨舉著音響了(http://0rz.tw/NZmWy)...而也許這明晚
Say Anything • In Your Eyes • Peter Gabriel - YouTube
**SEE MORE MOVIE TRIBUTES LIKE THIS ONE ON MY CHANNEL** The 1989 Cameron Crowe film "Say Anything" with John Cusack, Ione Skye & John Mahoney. Radio scene, b...
**SEE MORE MOVIE TRIBUTES LIKE THIS ONE ON MY CHANNEL** The 1989 Cameron Crowe film "Say Anything" with John Cusack, Ione Skye & John Mahoney. Radio scene, b...
就會發生。他的策略其實是有道理的:沒有現役前十的球員你是拿不到總冠軍的。
但火箭隊是不幸的,自從姚麥組合崩裂之後,他們就深陷無主之地之中。去年,他
們衛冕樂透區冠軍而且還交了豪華稅,這是不該發生的——在一個有30支隊伍的聯
盟裡,要麼墊底,要麼有競爭總冠軍的實力,但你不能徘徊中游。火箭花了三年時
間積攢籌碼和薪金空間就是為了這一刻。要麼弄來Howard,要麼弄來Bynum,要麼
推倒重來。(註1)
但火箭隊是不幸的,自從姚麥組合崩裂之後,他們就深陷無主之地之中。去年,他
們衛冕樂透區冠軍而且還交了豪華稅,這是不該發生的——在一個有30支隊伍的聯
盟裡,要麼墊底,要麼有競爭總冠軍的實力,但你不能徘徊中游。火箭花了三年時
間積攢籌碼和薪金空間就是為了這一刻。要麼弄來Howard,要麼弄來Bynum,要麼
推倒重來。(註1)
1. I've written this before, but Daryl's strategy is statistically
fascinating — if he pulled a 2012 Hornets and tanked an entire season, he'd
have something like a 10 to 12 percent chance of drafting a franchise player
when you multiply the best lottery odds (25 percent) with the odds of a
legitimate franchise player being available during that specific year
(probably 50-60 percent). If he gets Howard, the odds aren't much different
that Howard might decide to stick around — maybe 10 to 15 percent — only he
gets one contending season with Howard, the chance to sign and trade him AND
eight to 10 months on selling Howard on Houston. And if none of this works
even as next season is happening, he can always flip him before the trade
deadline. Again, as a pure "playing the odds" ploy, it makes sense.
作者註1:我在之前寫過關於這的文章,Morey的策略從數據上分析是極棒的——如
果他採取2011-12賽季黃蜂隊的策略,一個賽季擺爛,那麼用拿到狀元簽的概率
(25%)乘以一屆選秀中出現合格看板球星的概率(可能是50%-60%)他們有10-12
%機率選中一位看板球星。如果他獲得Howard,那麼Howard留下的概率也不會差太
多——也許是10-15%——火箭獲得一個賽季Howard的使用權,度過一個有競爭力的
賽季,這期間續簽、交易或者花上8-10個月在休士頓兜售Howard都是有可能的。如
果這些在下賽季都沒有成功,那Morey也可以在交易截止日前把Howard快速拋售出去
。再次強調,純粹玩概率遊戲的話,Morey的策略是有意義的。
%機率選中一位看板球星。如果他獲得Howard,那麼Howard留下的概率也不會差太
多——也許是10-15%——火箭獲得一個賽季Howard的使用權,度過一個有競爭力的
賽季,這期間續簽、交易或者花上8-10個月在休士頓兜售Howard都是有可能的。如
果這些在下賽季都沒有成功,那Morey也可以在交易截止日前把Howard快速拋售出去
。再次強調,純粹玩概率遊戲的話,Morey的策略是有意義的。
[譯者註:Dork Elvis是Morey在美國的外號。dork相對於geek而言,對於Morey來說
,就是他是數據分析方面的奇才,但痴迷到了呆滯死板的地步;Elvis是因為Morey
和貓王長得有幾分相似。]
,就是他是數據分析方面的奇才,但痴迷到了呆滯死板的地步;Elvis是因為Morey
和貓王長得有幾分相似。]
Were there a few days when it seemed like Morey had outsmarted himself?
Actually, yeah. The Rockets allowed an emerging offensive star (Goran Dragic)
to leave for Phoenix (four years, $34 million), then dealt one of the
league's best bargains (Kyle Lowry, owed just $12 million total for the next
two seasons) for a future lottery pick to help The Howard Trade That Might
Not Happen, going from two quality point guards to zero in about five
nanoseconds. That's when one of my incredulous readers e-mailed me, "At what
point are we going to find out that Dork Elvis overdosed on bath salts and
tried to eat Kevin McHale's face off?" He salvaged that mini-crisis by giving
Jeremy Lin a back-loaded offer sheet ($24.9 million, three years) that the
Knicks didn't match. Why not just re-sign Dragic (a better player than Lin)
instead of sweating out an offer sheet and banking on James Dolan doing the
wrong thing?
是否有那麼幾天你會覺得Morey聰明反被聰明誤?當然,火箭白白把新興的進攻明星
Goran Dragic放回太陽(4年3400萬美元),然後交易掉了聯盟最實惠的球員之一(
Kyle Lowry,接下來兩年僅有1200萬的合約),換來一個未來的樂透選秀權,就是為
了交易到Howard這件可能不會實現的事,五納秒之內,兩個優質控衛變為零個。就在
那時我一位勇於質疑的讀者給我發電子郵件,「我倒想看看何時Dork Elvis會吸食浴
鹽過量,發狂到試圖把Kevin McHale的臉啃下來?」給Jeremy Lin開出一份背厚式合
約(3年2490萬美元),而尼克也沒有跟進,這讓Morey完成了小小的自我救贖。與其
費勁巴拉開個合約寄希望於James Dolan腦殘,為什麼就不續約Dragic(一個比
Goran Dragic放回太陽(4年3400萬美元),然後交易掉了聯盟最實惠的球員之一(
Kyle Lowry,接下來兩年僅有1200萬的合約),換來一個未來的樂透選秀權,就是為
了交易到Howard這件可能不會實現的事,五納秒之內,兩個優質控衛變為零個。就在
那時我一位勇於質疑的讀者給我發電子郵件,「我倒想看看何時Dork Elvis會吸食浴
鹽過量,發狂到試圖把Kevin McHale的臉啃下來?」給Jeremy Lin開出一份背厚式合
約(3年2490萬美元),而尼克也沒有跟進,這讓Morey完成了小小的自我救贖。與其
費勁巴拉開個合約寄希望於James Dolan腦殘,為什麼就不續約Dragic(一個比
Jeremy Lin更好的球員)?
[譯者註:浴鹽是一種新型迷幻劑,容易讓人發狂、暴力。]
補註:應是指日前美國邁阿密發生的啃臉食人魔案。
(Wait … I forgot … there are few safer bets in sports than James Dolan
doing the wrong thing. You're right.)
(等等...我忘了...體育界幾乎沒有比賭James Dolan腦殘更安全的賭注。Morey你是
對的。)
"We've had vicious kings and we've had idiot kings, but I don't
know if we've ever been cursed with a vicious idiot for a king."
「我們擁有過邪惡的君主,也擁有過白痴的君主,但我不知道我們會不會
受到擁有既邪惡又白痴君主的詛咒。」(Cut to the Knicks fans nodding.)
(鏡頭切到尼克球迷默默點頭。)
Here's the thing: The Knicks haven't worried about the financial
ramifications of a basketball decision since Dolan's daddy turned the team
over to him. Even the most grizzled, beaten-down Knicks diehard would admit,
"Dolan might be incompetent, but you can't say he's afraid to spend money."
That why I agree with what Jay Kang wrote earlier this week — this wasn't a
financially motivated decision, just a spiteful one. Dolan didn't appreciate
Lin's agent proactively screwing him over with a poison pill2 offer, and
responded accordingly.
事情是這樣的:自打Dolan的老爸把球隊交給他以來,尼克在做籃球方面抉擇的時候
還沒有為錢的問題擔心過。哪怕是最老派強硬的頑固分子都會承認,「Dolan也許不
稱職,但你不能說他害怕花錢。」這就是為什麼我同意這週早些時候Jay Kang
還沒有為錢的問題擔心過。哪怕是最老派強硬的頑固分子都會承認,「Dolan也許不
稱職,但你不能說他害怕花錢。」這就是為什麼我同意這週早些時候Jay Kang
(Simmons經營的體育新聞網站《Grantland》的專欄作家)所寫的—這決定(不跟進
Jeremy Lin的報價)不是因為錢,而是一種帶著怨氣的行為。Dolan不喜歡Jeremy Lin
的經紀人用毒藥合約(註2)來噁心他,所以就做出了相應的回應。
Jeremy Lin的報價)不是因為錢,而是一種帶著怨氣的行為。Dolan不喜歡Jeremy Lin
的經紀人用毒藥合約(註2)來噁心他,所以就做出了相應的回應。
2. Despite what Lin said publicly, I think he wanted to go to the Rockets —
which is why his agent structured the offer sheet that way. Put it this way:
If you're Lin, and you're a relatively private guy who just wants to get paid
to play basketball without being thrust in the middle of some ego-ridden soap
opera, would you rather lead a team like the Rockets — where they'd build
their entire offense around you and let you do your thing — or would you
rather play on the Knicks with two other point guards and two me-first
scorers who can't succeed unless the offense is running through them at all
times? And by the way — the biggest loser here was Tyson Chandler, who loved
playing with Lin and actually touched the ball once in a while with him.
He'll never see it again. Good luck setting those screens for the next three
years, Tyson.
作者註2:無論Jeremy Lin在大眾面前怎麼說,我認為他想去火箭——這也是為什麼
他的經紀人設置了那樣的合約結構。這麼說:如果你是Jeremy Lin,而且你是一個相
對喜歡私人空間的人,只想靠著打球掙錢,不想被推上自負驅使的肥皂劇的風口浪尖
,你是傾向於去帶領火箭這樣一支球隊——在那兒,整個球隊的進攻圍繞著你進行,
你也可以做自己想做的事?——還是會選擇尼克這樣的球隊,與兩個控衛還有兩個自
我至上、不圍繞他們打進攻就成功不了的得分手搭檔?順便提一句——這場鬧劇中最
大的輸家是Tyson Chandler,他愛和Jeremy Lin一起打球,在與Lin搭檔的那段時間
裡,他時不時地還能獲得一些球權。而這種好日子再也不會有了。接下來三年就打掩
護/擋人吧,祝你好運,Tyson。
對喜歡私人空間的人,只想靠著打球掙錢,不想被推上自負驅使的肥皂劇的風口浪尖
,你是傾向於去帶領火箭這樣一支球隊——在那兒,整個球隊的進攻圍繞著你進行,
你也可以做自己想做的事?——還是會選擇尼克這樣的球隊,與兩個控衛還有兩個自
我至上、不圍繞他們打進攻就成功不了的得分手搭檔?順便提一句——這場鬧劇中最
大的輸家是Tyson Chandler,他愛和Jeremy Lin一起打球,在與Lin搭檔的那段時間
裡,他時不時地還能獲得一些球權。而這種好日子再也不會有了。接下來三年就打掩
護/擋人吧,祝你好運,Tyson。
[譯者註:譯者目測Simmons在吐槽Anthony說Lin的合約荒唐。]
You don't pull that sneaky shit with me after everything I did for you! I'm
James F-ing Dolan! Go to Houston for all I care, you'll never be seen again!
我做了這一切以後,你那些鬼鬼祟祟的狗屎般的把戲對我都失去了作用!我是
James F-ing Dolan!去休士頓吧,我才不在乎呢,我再也不會見你了!
That was the only plausible explanation: pure, unadulterated spite. When
you're hopelessly over the cap like New York (thanks, Amar'e!) and you've
already proven that you don't care about being fiscally responsible, why
allow a 23-year-old asset to leave for nothing … especially someone who
resonated with your fan base like no Knick since Latrell Sprewell? Lin would
have been underpaid in years one and two and violently overpaid in year three
(including luxury tax ramifications, Lin would have cost the Knicks $43
million in year three). Well … so what? What about Lin's value overseas, or
even his undeniable effect on MSG's stock? (It couldn't have been a
coincidence that Houston, the one team that knew exactly how valuable someone
with a Far East marketing reach could be, was the one that pursued Lin.)
Couldn't Lin have helped the Knicks contend next season? And after that, they
could have traded him in year two or year three to a team with cap space (or
for a better player) with other pieces thrown in. Who said they had to keep
him for all three years? Why not bring him back and figure the rest out later?
這是唯一比較靠譜的解釋:純粹地、完全地出於怨氣。當你的薪金總額像紐約一樣無
可救藥的時候(多謝你,Amare!)而且事實也證明你完全不擔心財政,那為什麼讓
一個23歲的人才白白溜走...特別是Latrell Sprewell之後還沒有尼克球員能在球迷
中引起如此大的轟動呢。(如果尼克跟進合約)Jeremy Lin前兩年拿的薪水會比較低
,而在第三年他的薪水會異常之高(算上豪華稅罰款,尼克三年裡會在Lin身上花
可救藥的時候(多謝你,Amare!)而且事實也證明你完全不擔心財政,那為什麼讓
一個23歲的人才白白溜走...特別是Latrell Sprewell之後還沒有尼克球員能在球迷
中引起如此大的轟動呢。(如果尼克跟進合約)Jeremy Lin前兩年拿的薪水會比較低
,而在第三年他的薪水會異常之高(算上豪華稅罰款,尼克三年裡會在Lin身上花
4300萬美元)。好吧...這又怎樣?Lin在大洋彼岸的商業價值有多大?甚至他對麥迪
遜廣場花園(MSG)股價絕對意義上的影響力又有多大?(休士頓這支深諳遙遠東方市
場價值的球隊加入Jeremy Lin的爭奪中可不是巧合。)他難道不能幫助尼克在下賽季
中保持競爭力嗎?退一步講,他們也可以在第二年或者第三年搭上其他砝碼把Lin交易
到一個有薪金空間的球隊(或者換一個更好的球員)。誰說他們就得把Lin留三年?
遜廣場花園(MSG)股價絕對意義上的影響力又有多大?(休士頓這支深諳遙遠東方市
場價值的球隊加入Jeremy Lin的爭奪中可不是巧合。)他難道不能幫助尼克在下賽季
中保持競爭力嗎?退一步講,他們也可以在第二年或者第三年搭上其他砝碼把Lin交易
到一個有薪金空間的球隊(或者換一個更好的球員)。誰說他們就得把Lin留三年?
為什麼不留下他,其他的再慢慢觀察?
For everyone dismissing last season's Linsanity binge as something of a
fluke, here's a news flash for you: This isn't baseball. This isn't Kevin
Maas or Phil Plantier catching fire for a few weeks before the league figured
them out. I watched those games. Even in a somewhat small sample size, Lin
proved that he's either a quality starter (best-case scenario) or something
of a rich man's J.J. Barea, an irrational confidence guy who gives you
instant offense off the bench (worst-case scenario). Letting an asset leave
for nothing? Really stupid. Letting that asset leave because you'd rather
spend that money on Jason Kidd (39 years old, effectively washed-up), Marcus
Camby (on his last legs) and Ray Felton (the most loathed Trail Blazer maybe
ever)? That's really stupid AND an appallingly bad business decision. And by
the way …
對於每一個把上賽季「Linsanity」熱當成僥倖成功的人來說,這有一則簡訊:這可
不是棒球。這也不是Kevin Maas和Phil Plantier(補註)在聯盟發現他們幾週後大
紅大紫。 我看了那幾場比賽。儘管樣本有些小,但Lin證明了他要麼是一個合格的
不是棒球。這也不是Kevin Maas和Phil Plantier(補註)在聯盟發現他們幾週後大
紅大紫。 我看了那幾場比賽。儘管樣本有些小,但Lin證明了他要麼是一個合格的
先發(最好的情況),要麼是富人版的J.J. Barea,帶著荒謬的自信從板凳上給你帶
來即插即用的進攻(最差的情況)。白白放走這樣一位人才?真的很愚蠢。放走這樣
以為人才,因為你寧願給Jason Kidd(39歲,已經死在沙灘上了),Marcus Camby(
苟延殘喘中)還有Ray Felton(也許是史上最令拓荒者討厭的球員)合約?這真的很
愚蠢而且也是一個令人毛骨悚然的商業決定。而且...
以為人才,因為你寧願給Jason Kidd(39歲,已經死在沙灘上了),Marcus Camby(
苟延殘喘中)還有Ray Felton(也許是史上最令拓荒者討厭的球員)合約?這真的很
愚蠢而且也是一個令人毛骨悚然的商業決定。而且...
(補註:兩者皆為菜鳥賽季表現最亮眼的前大聯盟選手,曇花一現的代表。)
"Tears aren't a woman's only weapon. The best one's between your legs."3
“眼淚不是女人唯一的武器。最好武器在你兩腿之間。”(註3)
SPOILER ALERT — This quote was uttered by Cersei, the incestuous queen who
cracks the short list of the most evil female characters in TV history. She
doesn't have a single redeeming quality other than her love for her children
… who, of course, were little creepy incest babies. Needless to say, she's
hot and I'm attracted to her.
作者註3:注意——這句話是瑟曦所說,瑟曦是一位亂倫皇后。她打破了電視劇歷史
上所有蛇蠍女人的共有特徵,除了對孩子的愛她沒有任何附加技能...當然,她還會
亂倫。不用說,她很性感,而我被她吸引了。
Smart advice (at least in medieval times) for the entire Knicks fan base. You
only have one weapon as fans: The right to stop supporting your team. I hate
to break it to you, but you have a better chance of watching this entire song
100 times in a row without stopping than seeing Dolan sell the Knicks. He
will own your team until he dies, or until he's electrocuted by a suicidal
microphone during a JD and the Straight Shot concert (whatever comes first).
That's another 30 to 40 years. With Brooklyn launching a second New York team
next October, you have a natural out — a one-time-only chance to run from
Dolan, switch local allegiances and never look back. You could also renounce
the Knicks and become an NBA widow. Or, you could be a loyal sap, remain a
Knicks fan and be perpetually bitter … but at the very least, sleep well at
night knowing that you stuck with your boys through thick and thin. I support
any of those three choices. Either way, it's a shame that one of the best fan
bases in any sport is saddled with an owner like that.
給全體尼克球迷的聰明的建議(至少在中世紀有效)。作為球迷你只有一個武器:
停止支持你的主隊。我不喜歡把一切都挑明了,但你不間斷地把這首歌(
http://0rz.tw/rvyPO)聽100遍的可能性都比你看到Dolan賣掉尼克的可能性要大。
JD and the Straight Shot Lie No Better LIVE - YouTube
JD and the Straight Shot perform their hit "Lie No Better" Live.
JD and the Straight Shot perform their hit "Lie No Better" Live.
除非等到他老死或者等到他在“ JD and the Straight ”的音樂會上被自殺麥克
風電死(我第一時間想到了這種情況),他都會是這支球隊的老闆。這又是30到40
年啊。十月份布魯克林就會降臨第二支紐約球隊,你自然就有了逃離苦海的機會—
—唯一遠離Dolan的機會,換一支當地的球隊作主隊,然後再也不回頭。當然你也可
以休掉尼克,成為無主隊的單身球迷。或者,你也可以死忠,依舊作為一個尼克球
迷,然後終身品嚐苦澀...但至少,在知道不管發生任何情況你都得支持你的球員們
這點之後,你要能睡得安穩。我支持這三種選擇的任意一種。不管怎麼選,在任何體
育運動中,如此有粉絲基礎的運動隊擁有這麼一位老闆都是莫大的恥辱。
風電死(我第一時間想到了這種情況),他都會是這支球隊的老闆。這又是30到40
年啊。十月份布魯克林就會降臨第二支紐約球隊,你自然就有了逃離苦海的機會—
—唯一遠離Dolan的機會,換一支當地的球隊作主隊,然後再也不回頭。當然你也可
以休掉尼克,成為無主隊的單身球迷。或者,你也可以死忠,依舊作為一個尼克球
迷,然後終身品嚐苦澀...但至少,在知道不管發生任何情況你都得支持你的球員們
這點之後,你要能睡得安穩。我支持這三種選擇的任意一種。不管怎麼選,在任何體
育運動中,如此有粉絲基礎的運動隊擁有這麼一位老闆都是莫大的恥辱。
[譯者註:JD and the Straight是Dolan組建的爵士樂隊。]
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這篇談休賽季交易的稿子裡大量穿插了冰與火之歌改編美劇《權力遊戲》的台詞,
內容相當有趣,除了Lin以外的部分也值得一讀喔。
--
※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc)
◆ From: 118.169.42.163
推 :雖然作者有些看法我不同意,但他引用權力遊戲來對照,讓1F 08/01 00:03
→ :這篇文章讀起來很有趣!尤其在酸Dolan的部份,很好笑XDDD
→ :這篇文章讀起來很有趣!尤其在酸Dolan的部份,很好笑XDDD
→ :感謝shadow大轉文 剛剛看過原文 Bill Simmons真是娛樂寫手3F 08/01 00:05
推 :感謝分享4F 08/01 00:06
→ :"鏡頭切到尼克球迷默默點頭"那句也太傳神 XD5F 08/01 00:06
推 :alex爸: 我人生中的三十年來...(默默點頭) XDDDD6F 08/01 00:08
推 :看了Simmons的註 我好同情拳王 再也摸不到球的最大輸家Q.Q7F 08/01 00:10
推 :也許NOVAK可以陪他……XD8F 08/01 00:13
推 :喔~對耶 還有Novak (默默點頭) XDDDDD9F 08/01 00:15
推 :寫得很歡樂10F 08/01 00:18
推 :有提到鎖喉手Sprewell!!!11F 08/01 00:57
推 :翻譯未免太親民了...真酷12F 08/01 01:05
※ 編輯: shadowydark 來自: 118.169.42.163 (08/01 04:16)推 :被麥克風電掛XDDD 拳王:林兄弟 洒家需要你呀(吼)13F 08/01 09:17
推 :籃球世界越看越複雜...= =14F 08/01 09:37
推 :推~~15F 08/01 10:02
推 :感謝分享...感謝!16F 08/01 13:17
推 :超有趣的 XD17F 08/01 15:57
推 :一看到LBJ坐在鐵王座的插圖我就噗哧了…文章裡對於Nash18F 08/01 17:51
→ :到湖人糾結成這樣也很好笑,他真的很討厭湖人XDDD
→ :個人覺得杜蘭根本真人版喬佛里…殘暴又無腦
→ :到湖人糾結成這樣也很好笑,他真的很討厭湖人XDDD
→ :個人覺得杜蘭根本真人版喬佛里…殘暴又無腦
推 :好高級的杜蘭酸XDDDDD21F 08/01 21:13
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※ 看板: kulinomi 文章推薦值: 0 目前人氣: 0 累積人氣: 115
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